Fat Albert the Apache needed his annual exam... When I bought him the
annual was in the summer and I have been gaining a month a year on
that... This year we moved it into December 1st... The annual usually
takes 3-5 days, but this morning he still sits in the shop with the
starboard engine uncowled after 3 weeks... I have been proactive in
doing preventive maintenance between annuals and normally we breeze
through the annual... This year there were two AD's that needed to be
satisfied...

One was the flap torque arm and torque tube... This is pretty straight
foward... We pulled them out (labor hours) and although they were
perfect the AD is recurring annually as long as the original parts
remain... I ordered the steel torque tube (~1.5" x 36")to replace the
aluminum tube and it was $400 (hey, it's for an airplane)... The torque
arm however was a nine inch long, $1600 item for something that any
competent machine shop would make from scratch for $40 in material and
a $150 in labor and CNC machine time - Piper's price is big time rape!
Steve, the mechanic, was really po'd at Piper over this part... He
finally found a serviceable part from a wrecked plane that met the AD
and was available for 50% of new, so we went that route...

The other AD was the pressure test on the heater can... Of course it
has a small crack, but worse it had been welded before (no entry on the
logs) so it was DOA... Plus the Southwind heater would continue to be
a recurring AD... The heater shops wanted $1800 to zero time the
heater, plus $650 to replace the solenoid fuel valves... A search was
started and we wound up with C&D which is just downstate from us...
They have PMA for a brand new heater which wound up being $3200 by the
time it was delivered... The big labor costs in this are the install
and the new panel switch and wiring.. But, I have a no AD heater,
which is new and shiny and has a warranty...

Next on the hit list was that the port engine backfired when I started
it up to fly over to the shop for the annual, ran rough for 10 seconds
then smoothed out (picture me with raised eyebrow and cringing wallet)
it has never done this before... When we got to the shop the first
thing we do is a compression test while the engine is hot... #1
cylinder on port side has zero compression... Pull the rocker cover and
sure enough the exhaust valve lacks about a sixteenth of an inch of
closing... So, Steve drives the valve out, reams the guide (carbon
buildup, no warpage) and reassembles... Borescopes the cylinder and
pressure tests again, all OK now... So more bucks for labor...

The other item on the hit list was that the starboard engine has been
gradually running leaner over a period of months.. In cruise the
starboard mixture knob is now an inch and a half ahead of the port
mixture knob for the same egt... It has been looked at twice with no
obvious leaks... With the engine totally uncowled we go after it with a
vengence... The induction hoses and clamps are replaced with new, and
all new intake gaskets... Pressure testing shows bubbles where the
induction tube for the #1 cylinder is pressed into the oil pan... This
is sealed up... The engine is test run, and the cowl is replaced...

Annual is finished and I'm to test fly it... The flight delivers no
joy with the starboard engine still considerably leaner than the port
engine, even at full rich on both mixtures... Ah jeez! So, back in
the shop, off with the cowlings (half an hour for two mechanics), and
we start glaring at the carburetor... The throttle shaft has some slop
in it, but the throttle shaft on the port engine, which runs fine, is
looser still - and we don't think that is the problem... After
considerable peering and poking and wiggling we (three of us by now)
decide that the shaft on the mixture has too much play... So off comes
the carburetor (more labor time as it is well buried...

Up on the bench we disassemble the carb... The mixture shaft is worn
and the brass washers show eccentric wear... A parts count and
comparison to the manual shows an O-ring is totally missing... This
could upset the air pressure above the fuel at the main metering valve
down in the bowl... OK, so we stop for the night... The next day Steve
calls Lycoming and talks to their carb expert... He opines that the air
leak around the mixture shaft will cause the engine to run lean... He
wants $450 for a rebuild kit... A call to avial shows that they want
$1000 for a rebuilt carb... I say let me think about it and go home...
A bit of skulking on the web brings up aircraft spruce as having a
rebuilt carb in stock for $529... It is ordered, next day air for an
extra 40 some bucks... The carb is put on, the engine test run, cowl
put on, and the plane is ready for a test flight...

So, I hurry through the office Saturday and manage to get in a days
work and be out to the airport with daylight left... Everyone is all
smiles, so in anticipation of delivering the plane back to the home
field it is fully fueled, etc.. The wind is from the same side of the
field as the shop, so we have to taxi 3/4 of a mile.. By the time I get
to the runup pad the starboard engine is wallowing and slowly winds
down and quits... Pat, the mechanic, who is in the right seat peers out
and says, hmmm there's fuel dripping off the cowl... (&*%#$@ bad word
said) We limp back to the shop on one engine (twins taxi terrible on
one engine)...

Testing at the shop shows fuel running through the carb... Off come the
cowls and the carb... Monday morning (today) Kelly Aerospace is called
and the problem discussed... They want the carb back for examination
and will ship me a replacement carb same day as mine arrives there...
So here we go with a round of $60+ next day shipping charges... I was
going to wait until the annual was over to post this, but who knows
when that will be... Anyway, the fun meter has passed $9,000 and is
still running...
Cheers...
Denny of the Lean Wallet, and Fat Albert the Apache

Dang, sorry to hear about the carb problems... hopefully when you get them
resolved it will make flying FA feel a little sweeter. Glad the torque tube
issue didn't turn out that bad, I've heard some horror stories about not
getting the replacement drilled correctly.

Merry Christmas,
Jim



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Yup Jim.... I told Steve that if he misdrilled that tube HE was paying
for the replacement and the shipping and labor was on his nickle, not
mine... When I got back to the shop a day later it was all
installed... I asked him how the drilling went... He pulled his pipe
out of his mouth, scowled at me, and said, "What a ^&%$*# miserable
job... I spent 2 hours getting that thing jigged up and drilling four
holes... But that's OK because I'm charging for the time!"... Then he
smiled an evil smile and lit his pipe and walked away contentedly
blowing clouds of evil smoke... I discussed his ancestry, just loud
enough for him to hear... That made him really smile... Actually, if
I didn't insult him, I suspect he would charge me more...

Steve is an old time A&PI with decades of experience on Apaches and
Aztecs... I had no reservations about his ability to do the job right
the first time...

HA! He sounds like a combination of Santa Claus and the Grinch! Too funny!
Glad he got it all installed for you. I wish we had more A&P's like him
around here, most of them here don't have nearly that much experience,
patience, or stick-with-it-ness but they sure know how to charge!

You mentioned that C&D is just downstate from you... what part of MI are you
in? I'm planning on flying over to Hastings (just south east of GRR)
Christmas Eve and back to WI Christmas day. How much snow is there in that
area? We got about 8 inches here last night.

Jim

"Denny" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Yup Jim.... I told Steve that if he misdrilled that tube HE was paying
> for the replacement and the shipping and labor was on his nickle, not
> mine... When I got back to the shop a day later it was all
> installed... I asked him how the drilling went... He pulled his pipe
> out of his mouth, scowled at me, and said, "What a ^&%$*# miserable
> job... I spent 2 hours getting that thing jigged up and drilling four
> holes... But that's OK because I'm charging for the time!"... Then he
> smiled an evil smile and lit his pipe and walked away contentedly
> blowing clouds of evil smoke... I discussed his ancestry, just loud
> enough for him to hear... That made him really smile... Actually, if
> I didn't insult him, I suspect he would charge me more...
>
> Steve is an old time A&PI with decades of experience on Apaches and
> Aztecs... I had no reservations about his ability to do the job right
> the first time...
>


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Repeat slowly and carefully after me:

The owner or operator of an aircraft is allowed to manufacture parts for
his/her own aircraft. Say it again. Understand that you do not have to
have your hand on the drill press or CNC buttons. The FAA is satisfied that
you take a drawing down to your local machine shop and oversee their
manufacture of your part. Or you can make it yourself, your choice.

Now, say it one more time...

Jim




"Denny" > wrote in message
oups.com...


The torque
> arm however was a nine inch long, $1600 item for something that any
> competent machine shop would make from scratch for $40 in material and
> a $150 in labor and CNC machine time - Piper's price is big time rape!
> Steve, the mechanic, was really po'd at Piper over this part... He
> finally found a serviceable part from a wrecked plane that met the AD
> and was available for 50% of new, so we went that route...

"RST Engineering" > wrote in message
...
> Repeat slowly and carefully after me:
>
> The owner or operator of an aircraft is allowed to manufacture parts for
> his/her own aircraft. Say it again. Understand that you do not have to
> have your hand on the drill press or CNC buttons. The FAA is satisfied
that
> you take a drawing down to your local machine shop and oversee their
> manufacture of your part. Or you can make it yourself, your choice.
>
> Now, say it one more time...
>
> Jim

You're an A&P with inspection authorization, aren't you? Please cite the
FAR. I think I know which one you're talking about but it seems you'd be
more authoritative by referring to the book.
>
>
>
>
> "Denny" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>
>
> The torque
> > arm however was a nine inch long, $1600 item for something that any
> > competent machine shop would make from scratch for $40 in material and
> > a $150 in labor and CNC machine time - Piper's price is big time rape!
> > Steve, the mechanic, was really po'd at Piper over this part... He
> > finally found a serviceable part from a wrecked plane that met the AD
> > and was available for 50% of new, so we went that route...
>
>

" jls" > wrote in message
...
>
> "RST Engineering" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Repeat slowly and carefully after me:
>>
>> The owner or operator of an aircraft is allowed to manufacture parts for
>> his/her own aircraft. Say it again. Understand that you do not have to
>> have your hand on the drill press or CNC buttons. The FAA is satisfied
> that
>> you take a drawing down to your local machine shop and oversee their
>> manufacture of your part. Or you can make it yourself, your choice.
>>
>> Now, say it one more time...
>>
>> Jim
>
> You're an A&P with inspection authorization, aren't you? Please cite the
> FAR. I think I know which one you're talking about but it seems you'd be
> more authoritative by referring to the book.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Denny" > wrote in message
>> oups.com...
>>
>>
>> The torque
>> > arm however was a nine inch long, $1600 item for something that any
>> > competent machine shop would make from scratch for $40 in material and
>> > a $150 in labor and CNC machine time - Piper's price is big time rape!
>> > Steve, the mechanic, was really po'd at Piper over this part... He
>> > finally found a serviceable part from a wrecked plane that met the AD
>> > and was available for 50% of new, so we went that route...
>>
>>
http://www.avionicswest.com/myviewpoint/partsowner.htm#2004
http://www.iflyamerica.org/ownerproducedparts.htm
http://www.faa.gov/avr/afs/news/archive/Jul_Aug2002/Parts.htm
http://www.faa.gov/avr/afs/news/archive/julyaugust/IvsWe.htm

My only question? Why are some links blue, and some purple?

Karl
"Curator" N185KG

"kage" > wrote in message
...
>
> " jls" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "RST Engineering" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >> Repeat slowly and carefully after me:
> >>
> >> The owner or operator of an aircraft is allowed to manufacture parts
for
> >> his/her own aircraft. Say it again. Understand that you do not have
to
> >> have your hand on the drill press or CNC buttons. The FAA is satisfied
> > that
> >> you take a drawing down to your local machine shop and oversee their
> >> manufacture of your part. Or you can make it yourself, your choice.
> >>
> >> Now, say it one more time...
> >>
> >> Jim
> >
> > You're an A&P with inspection authorization, aren't you? Please cite
the
> > FAR. I think I know which one you're talking about but it seems you'd
be
> > more authoritative by referring to the book.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> "Denny" > wrote in message
> >> oups.com...
> >>
> >>
> >> The torque
> >> > arm however was a nine inch long, $1600 item for something that any
> >> > competent machine shop would make from scratch for $40 in material
and
> >> > a $150 in labor and CNC machine time - Piper's price is big time
rape!
> >> > Steve, the mechanic, was really po'd at Piper over this part... He
> >> > finally found a serviceable part from a wrecked plane that met the AD
> >> > and was available for 50% of new, so we went that route...
> >>
> >>
> http://www.avionicswest.com/myviewpoint/partsowner.htm#2004
> http://www.iflyamerica.org/ownerproducedparts.htm
> http://www.faa.gov/avr/afs/news/archive/Jul_Aug2002/Parts.htm
> http://www.faa.gov/avr/afs/news/archive/julyaugust/IvsWe.htm
>
> My only question? Why are some links blue, and some purple?
>
> Karl
> "Curator" N185KG

Well, now, if you ain't just a gentleman and a scholar. Thanks. I figured
that authority was somewhere in Part 23.

kage wrote:
>
> My only question? Why are some links blue, and some purple?

Usually this is because you have set your browser to display links you haven't
visited recently as blue text and those you have visited recently as purple.
These are the default colors for Netscape. I believe the default for "recently"
is 10 days. Both the colors and the retention period are settable parameters.

George Patterson
The desire for safety stands against every great and noble enterprise.

jls wrote:
>
> You're an A&P with inspection authorization, aren't you? Please cite the
> FAR. I think I know which one you're talking about but it seems you'd be
> more authoritative by referring to the book.

Karl has posted links. To do Jim justice, Jim has posted the applicable regs
before.

George Patterson
The desire for safety stands against every great and noble enterprise.

As the inititator of this thread, just thought I would update... Fat
Albert still sits lacking a carburetor on the port engine... I sent the
new, but very defective, remanufactured carb back to Kelly Aerospace on
Monday, via next day air... They promised to do the same the day they
had their carb in hand... At worst it should have arrived by noon on
Thursday... Of course it is now a week later and I have no carb... Of
course, Kelly Aerospace is not answering the phone from Thursday on...
It is now a month since the annual commenced... Steve may have to
start charging me hangar rent...

Denny

Just got off the phone with Steve... The replacement carburetor from
Kelly Aerospace came late Friday, so being Christmas Eve he hung it on
the plane and went home without calling me.. Today he finished the hook
up and pushed the plane out to start it.. The bottom line is the
replacement, zero timed, CERTIFIED, carburetor leaks even worse than
the one we sent back as defective - dumped fuel all over the ground the
instant he hit the boost pump, and he aborted the start... He called
Kelly Aerospace and they told him to open the carburetor and see what
the problem is... Jeez, the original, worn out carb didn't dump fuel
on the ground and was flyable as long as you paid attention to the
EGT... The only thing I can do is laugh as the labor bill keeps going
up...

I asked Steve how long he has been wrenching on airplanes... He said
more than 40 years... I asked him if he had ever had two zero timed,
carburetors in a row be defective... He said no... I'm waiting for a
call back on what he found but it's after 6PM and I'm going home, so
thought I would post this update...
Denny

In my recent experience Kelly products are not holding up as well as the
original manufacturers stuff did. I don't have anything concrete to point to
but I have sent back more Kelly accessories than anything else.

John Dupre'

>The replacement carburetor from
>Kelly Aerospace came late Friday,

snip

>The bottom line is the
>replacement, zero timed, CERTIFIED, carburetor leaks even worse than
>the one we sent back as defective -

Gees!!! When will this nitemare end! That royally SUCKS! Let us know where
exactly it is leaking from... truly weird.

We've been having ongoing problems with our autopilot, an S-Tec 60-2. First
a runaway trim so they pulled the pitch computer, sent it to S-Tec and for
$150 the told us it was A-OK. Now we pulled the pitch servo and sent it in
for diagnostics and possible new switches. We've been flying in without
pitch or altitude hold and it seems to work fine until last night when one
of the other partners said that in HDG mode it oscillates about 10 degrees
one way and then corrects back 10 degrees the other way. NAV mode works
perfect other than it tracks with the cdi needle 2 1/2 degrees left.

Good luck with the carb, I feel for you.

Jim

"Denny" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> Just got off the phone with Steve... The replacement carburetor from
> Kelly Aerospace came late Friday, so being Christmas Eve he hung it on
> the plane and went home without calling me.. Today he finished the hook
> up and pushed the plane out to start it.. The bottom line is the
> replacement, zero timed, CERTIFIED, carburetor leaks even worse than
> the one we sent back as defective - dumped fuel all over the ground the
> instant he hit the boost pump, and he aborted the start... He called
> Kelly Aerospace and they told him to open the carburetor and see what
> the problem is... Jeez, the original, worn out carb didn't dump fuel
> on the ground and was flyable as long as you paid attention to the
> EGT... The only thing I can do is laugh as the labor bill keeps going
> up...
>
> I asked Steve how long he has been wrenching on airplanes... He said
> more than 40 years... I asked him if he had ever had two zero timed,
> carburetors in a row be defective... He said no... I'm waiting for a
> call back on what he found but it's after 6PM and I'm going home, so
> thought I would post this update...
> Denny
>

Well, it's Tuesday... Steve called back and says the carb is on, the
engine has been extensively ground run, the cowl is on, and the
airplane is ready for flight testing... I'm trapped here at the office
and there is freezing rain outside and more predicted for the night...
Maybe I'll be able to test fly it tomorrow, and maybe I won't...

The bottom line is that the guy at Kelly Aerospace did not replace my
remanufactured carburetor as promised, but 'overhauled' and returned
the carburetor to me... He stated to Steve that he personally stood
there and watched the work being done (the point of this will be clear
in a minute)... Anyway, Steve disassembled the
overhauled-remanufactured carb at the direction of Kelly Aerospace and
found that the the pivot pin for the float was missing the cotter key
that keeps the pin from sliding out and jamming the float... He put in
a new cotter pin, verified that the float height is correct set, (it
was) and the bench repaired carb now works perfectly...

When Steve called Kelly Aerospace back with the news, the guy's comment
was, "That's interesting." When Steve called me I asked him if the
guy's seeing-eye dog needed glasses... Now the "interesting" part will
come when Steve and I discuss the bill... It seems to me that Kelly
Aerospace has some responsibility for the labor to remove the carb, the
shipping costs, the labor to reinstall it, the labor to remove it a
second time, the bench time to fix it, and the labor to reinstall it a
second time... Once I am presented with Steve's bill I will be calling
Kelly Aerospace to enquire as to how they see their responsibility
here...

Denny

I would have a product liability lawyer send Kelly your bill. Missing
cotter pin that holds the pivot pin for the float?! Float drops to the
bottom of the bowl calling for more fuel flow and spilling fuel
everywhere.... sounds like a good start to an engine fire. I wouldn't pay
them a dime, I'd tell them to sue me. Order a few more things from Kelly,
then deduct Steve's labor invoice from Kelly's statement. How can they
expect that you should pay for finishing their work and for all the problems
and costs you had to incur from it?

Glad to hear it's ready for some air time!

Jim

"Denny" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> Well, it's Tuesday... Steve called back and says the carb is on, the
> engine has been extensively ground run, the cowl is on, and the
> airplane is ready for flight testing... I'm trapped here at the office
> and there is freezing rain outside and more predicted for the night...
> Maybe I'll be able to test fly it tomorrow, and maybe I won't...
>
> The bottom line is that the guy at Kelly Aerospace did not replace my
> remanufactured carburetor as promised, but 'overhauled' and returned
> the carburetor to me... He stated to Steve that he personally stood
> there and watched the work being done (the point of this will be clear
> in a minute)... Anyway, Steve disassembled the
> overhauled-remanufactured carb at the direction of Kelly Aerospace and
> found that the the pivot pin for the float was missing the cotter key
> that keeps the pin from sliding out and jamming the float... He put in
> a new cotter pin, verified that the float height is correct set, (it
> was) and the bench repaired carb now works perfectly...
>
> When Steve called Kelly Aerospace back with the news, the guy's comment
> was, "That's interesting." When Steve called me I asked him if the
> guy's seeing-eye dog needed glasses... Now the "interesting" part will
> come when Steve and I discuss the bill... It seems to me that Kelly
> Aerospace has some responsibility for the labor to remove the carb, the
> shipping costs, the labor to reinstall it, the labor to remove it a
> second time, the bench time to fix it, and the labor to reinstall it a
> second time... Once I am presented with Steve's bill I will be calling
> Kelly Aerospace to enquire as to how they see their responsibility
> here...
>
> Denny
>

Gawd, I'm begining to feel like I'm writing episodes for a soap opera,
or something... But, here we go with the next installment...

I hurried through my work Wednesday as best I could and got the the
airport at 3 PM... Steve was all smiles, glad to finally have this
annual finished (6 weeks now)... The cowls were on and the airplane
ready to fly... So, out Doug (another guy that hangs around the shop)
and I went into the mist and haze of an indefinite ceiling... At least
we taxied to the end of the runway this time without fuel running on
the ground... Took off and climbed to a thousand feet... The starboard
engine does not run as lean as it did with the original carb that
started this whole thing going, but it is still showing significantly
higher EGT as compared to the (assumed) normal port engine at full
rich, and still over an inch of displacement between the knobs when
leaned to the same EGT, and the same when leaned further to just a
trace of roughness on each side (never blindly trust electronics)...

"Well, it's some better." - I say... The ceiling is dropping and ten
miles out we are forced down to 800 feet to stay out of the clag... We
go back and land and taxi in... Steve is out on the ramp, still all
smiles... I pull the mixture to cut off - and the engine continues to
run - and run, and run, shaking and wallowing like a wet dog - Steve
is not smiling... I goose the throttle to break the vacuum that is
pulling fuel through the carb, and it winds down... "Well, that's not
better." - I say... Back to square one!

We call Kelly Aerospace... He is just as unhappy as we are.. He tells
me to have Aircraft Spruce do a warranty exchange on his nickle, gives
me an RMA number for them so I can get another carb next day air... It
takes 40 minutes to get through to Aircraft Spruce... They flat refuse
to do a warranty exchange, stating that all warranty work has to go
directly through "Jerry" at Kelly Aerospace... Tim at Kelly, sighs,
and says he replaced "Jerry" three years ago... Never the less, the
little girl at Aircraft Spruce says she just works there and that is
what her computer screen says - no jerry, no carb... But if I give her
a credit card she can ship me a carb next day... Being that is a
thousand dollar bill that I 'know' will never get straightened out, I
decline... Tim sighs, says he has another core in house and has all
the parts needed, and he will have his guys stay late tonite
(Wednesday) to get it remanufactured and out the door Thursday so we
will get it Friday by next day air...

Now Steve sighs, and says that Friday is his wife's birthday and the
shop is closed, as well as the airport is unattended that day so no one
will be there to take a delivery, being both her birthday and New Years
Eve that night... For the first time in the decades that Steve has
been wrenching on my airplanes and for the first time in this entire
carburetor fiasco, I lost my smile...
In roughly ten seconds I explained that I was no longer a happy
camper... The cowl came off, the carb came off, and I am assured that
someone will be there to take delivery on Friday and that the airplane
will be ready before dark... We shall see...

Denny

I hope you fly it the same day he finishes it. Otherwise, he isn't
likely to be too happy, either.... although I feel your pain.
************************************************** ********************

Well, no pain, though some annoyance... Yeah, Steve is unhappy... Says
he has never had a thrash like this in 40 years of wrenching on
airplanes... I can't blame him, he is sick of putting the cowls on so I
can fly it, only to have to take them off again - which is a two man
job taking a good 30 minutes each way, though they seem to be getting
faster...With any luck, the next carburetor will have all of it's parts
and will actually shut off the fuel flow when the mixture is pulled to
cut off...
I will be over there Friday afternoon to baby sit the install job and
test fly it... That's assuming that Kelly Aerospace keeps it's word and
gets it here on time, they didn't the first time around..

Denny

Denny,
Is there an STC for a Split Lower Cowl modification for the Apache?
Something makes me think it was an option on Geronimo conversions.
Hopefully it will be too late to implement the STC (hoping that only one
more cowl off/cowl on round trip will be required of you!) but maybe an
option to think about in the future There are a couple outfits working on
an STC for the Aztec and we may look into it this summer during our annual.
A field approval for the cowl mod would also be an option. Either way it
should pay for itself in reduced labor costs.
Good luck!
Jim

"Denny" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> I hope you fly it the same day he finishes it. Otherwise, he isn't
> likely to be too happy, either.... although I feel your pain.
> ************************************************** ********************
>
> Well, no pain, though some annoyance... Yeah, Steve is unhappy... Says
> he has never had a thrash like this in 40 years of wrenching on
> airplanes... I can't blame him, he is sick of putting the cowls on so I
> can fly it, only to have to take them off again - which is a two man
> job taking a good 30 minutes each way, though they seem to be getting
> faster...With any luck, the next carburetor will have all of it's parts
> and will actually shut off the fuel flow when the mixture is pulled to
> cut off...
> I will be over there Friday afternoon to baby sit the install job and
> test fly it... That's assuming that Kelly Aerospace keeps it's word and
> gets it here on time, they didn't the first time around..
>
> Denny
>

"Jim Burns" > wrote in message
...
> Denny,
> Is there an STC for a Split Lower Cowl modification for the Apache?
> Something makes me think it was an option on Geronimo conversions.
> Hopefully it will be too late to implement the STC (hoping that only one
> more cowl off/cowl on round trip will be required of you!) but maybe an
> option to think about in the future There are a couple outfits working on
> an STC for the Aztec and we may look into it this summer during our
annual.
> A field approval for the cowl mod would also be an option. Either way it
> should pay for itself in reduced labor costs.
> Good luck!
> Jim
>

I have this on my Aztec, makes life a lot better overall (and you no longer
need two people to remove the cowls). I don't have an STC for it, as it was
done with a field approval.

--
Louis L. Perley III
N46000 - C152
N370 - PA-23-250

Louis,
Would you have any pictures or details on yours? I'd be interested in
seeing exactly how yours was done.

Jim


"Louis L. Perley III" > wrote in message
...
> "Jim Burns" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Denny,
> > Is there an STC for a Split Lower Cowl modification for the Apache?
> > Something makes me think it was an option on Geronimo conversions.
> > Hopefully it will be too late to implement the STC (hoping that only one
> > more cowl off/cowl on round trip will be required of you!) but maybe an
> > option to think about in the future There are a couple outfits working
on
> > an STC for the Aztec and we may look into it this summer during our
> annual.
> > A field approval for the cowl mod would also be an option. Either way
it
> > should pay for itself in reduced labor costs.
> > Good luck!
> > Jim
> >
>
> I have this on my Aztec, makes life a lot better overall (and you no
longer
> need two people to remove the cowls). I don't have an STC for it, as it
was
> done with a field approval.
>
> --
> Louis L. Perley III
> N46000 - C152
> N370 - PA-23-250
>
>

"Denny" > wrote in message
ps.com...

>
> "Well, it's some better." - I say... The ceiling is dropping and ten
> miles out we are forced down to 800 feet to stay out of the clag... We
> go back and land and taxi in... Steve is out on the ramp, still all
> smiles... I pull the mixture to cut off - and the engine continues to
> run - and run, and run, shaking and wallowing like a wet dog - Steve
> is not smiling... I goose the throttle to break the vacuum that is
> pulling fuel through the carb, and it winds down... "Well, that's not
> better." - I say... Back to square one!

I would have thought that this problem would have manifested itself when the
engine was shutdown after the test run and leak check post carby fittment.

Ric

Steve ran the engine on the ground doing several start up and shut
downs until he and the other mechanic were convinced the repaired 'new'
carb was good to go - especially since he is really frustrated over
this whole deal and was not going to put the cowlings back on just for
fun... However, ground running does not get the engine and carb as heat
soaked as a 20 mile circuit at 75%, and after that it did not cut the
fuel off completely... This carburetor has been an albatross from day
one, as you will see if you read my entire thread... It is now noon and
I'm waiting a call from Steve that the new, new, new carburetor has
arrived via untied parcel... Third times the charm, they say - whoever
'they' are...

OTOH, I just got my pickup back from the Chevy dealer 20 minutes ago
from replacing two antiskid sensors, including 2.5 hours of labor, it
cost me $450 dollars, so Steve is in the wrong business...

Denny

"Jim Burns" > wrote in message
...
> Louis,
> Would you have any pictures or details on yours? I'd be interested in
> seeing exactly how yours was done.
>
> Jim
>

I don't have anything on it, but that wouldn't stop me from taking some
pictures. I think I might have found some paperwork on it as well, but it's
in French (it was done in Canada), it has some drawings, etc. and what looks
like posible engineering info (don't know why they'd need this unless they
were pursuing a STC for the modification, but it's there) I'll see if I can
scan those in as well.

--
Louis L. Perley III
N46000 - C152
N370 - PA-23-250